Season 15, Episode 5 Transcript


– Hey, it’s CS Joseph at, coming from downtown Charlotte, North Carolina. It’s pretty loud out here. We’re gonna be talking about another episode here in season 15, I believe it’s episode 5. We’re gonna be talking about the difference between abstract and concrete. This is according to Linda Barrons, Dr. Linda Barrons. And we wanna talk about this because it’s going to give us some insight as to how to determine what is your temperament. Now, we talked about the interaction styles according to Linda Barrons, which is a direct versus informative, or initiating versus responding, or movement versus control, and how that ties into each of the interaction styles. So, that’d be the in charge or structure types, or the get things going or starter types, or see it through finisher types, as well as the behind the scenes or background types. All this different terminology just to figure out and master just to learn what their interaction style is. But after identifying someone’s interaction style you’ve eliminated 12 types. And you have four types to go, right? So, how do you figure out what according to the type grid their temperament is? So, there is another three sets of concepts to compare, and understand, and differentiate so that you can know who’s what basically. And with temperament it’s very important to do so because you can identify whether or not a person is a guardian, an artisan, an intellectual, or an idealist, right? Either of those temperaments give you an idea of how to classify them further. So, when you’re using the type grid, for example, if you know what their interaction style is, okay, well, is this a starter type? Okay, is this a starter guardian? 


Oh, the starter guardian equals ESFJ, right? Or is this a behind the scenes intellectual, that’s an INTP, right? Or is this an in charge idealist, oh, that’s an ENFJ. And you know with 100% accuracy as to which type of person is, you know, utilizing the type grid in this manner, it’s just like times tables. You just need to identify their interaction style and identify the temperament. And you instantly know what type they are. They don’t even need to take a test. You don’t need to subject them to a test. By the way, you should probably like never trust a test again, please. There’s no reason for that, don’t trust tests. There’s just no reason for it at all. So, with that in mind, let’s just move forward with this. So, how are we gonna do that? Well, today, we’re gonna be talking about the difference between abstract and concrete in terms of thinking, and decision-making, and perceptions, and whatnot. It’s very perception based, you know? How is sensory details considered from a person’s point of view? But let’s talk about what types are abstract and what types are concrete. If you are concrete you’re an SJ or an SP. If you are abstract you are an NT or an NF, basically. So you’re either intuitive, or you’re sensing basically. This is how you tell the difference between intuitive and sensing, essentially. Intuitives, because I’m an intuitive, let’s start there. This is a very unstable table, interestingly enough, that I’m holding this on. I’ll just hold it with my hand. Wow, the weather’s actually really nice today for being downtown Charlotte. 


Actually, I kind of like this town, a lot better than I was expecting it to be. So, how can you tell the difference if they’re sensing or intuitive? Again, abstraction versus concrete. The concrete is basically thinking from the point of view or perceiving mostly, this is mostly perception, right, sensing intuition. So we’re talking about perception primarily here, right? Do they primarily see things in the world as based on in terms of the what is? Or do they see it in terms of the what if, right? And the what if is abstraction. And the what is what is concrete, you know, it’s the concrete. So, I guess, let’s look at, like, the specific definition of what that would be. And I believe abstract, at least according to Linda Barrons, it’s about talking about or thinking of, it’s like super loud out here. There we go, a little bit more volume, right? So you can actually hear me. It’s like thinking or talking in terms of concepts, and patterns, and referencing sensory details as needed. It’s not like primarily focused on sensory details. It’s all about pattern recognition and concepts. It could be also implications, what a person is implying? You know, we talk about direct versus informative. And informative is all about implication, right? It’s all about implying. When you’re informative you’re implying, right, whereas direct there is no implication. 


You’re just stating it as is, right? You could say that direct is a more concrete form of communication. And informative is more of an abstract form of communication, right? But again, that’s just for your interaction style. It’s kind of interesting that from a perception point of view, you have concrete and abstracts as well, right? So yeah, multiple sides of the same coin available to all of human cognition, be it with how a person interacts, as well as how a person perceives on a daily basis, which is why we have abstract versus concrete. Another way to look at the abstract, because it’s like the great what if, it’s really attached to symbols, right? Symbols, patterns, hidden meanings, what if this, what if that? In general, it’s about possibilities and always being open to what’s possible. And people do this through introvert intuition, which is what is possible for me? Or what is the best or ideal path for me to take? What do I want to do today? Or you have the what if in terms of expert intuition, which is okay, well, what does that person want? Or what does that person intend? Or what do we want, what do we intend collectively? Where are we going collectively as a species or as a community? What are we going to be doing tomorrow? Or what is the best possible path available for all of us? Or what paths are available? Let me see what all paths are available before I make a decision as to which path it will be, right? So, each of those things are important when you’re considering the abstract. Abstract is the great what if. It’s always focused on what’s possible, or what might be, or what may be, right? So, if you’re talking to somebody, and they’re being really abstract about things, and focused on what if scenarios, or possibilities or examples, or almost parables to a point, you know, speaking in terms of symbols, concepts, implications, if they’re constantly implying things. Or saying hey, this idea or this concept, you know, this idea or this concept, what implication is it? What is it implying, you know? abstract also kind of has high introspection, at least according to Dr. Linda Barrons. 


It’s also constantly asking questions to try to understand the meaning behind things. You know, when people are constantly asking you, well, what does that mean, or what do you mean by that, they’re usually an abstract person, right? They’re usually an intuitive in that regard. And one thing I can say about the abstract, it kind of sees reality, you know, or common sense as something that’s very arbitrary, right? It’s a very arbitrary approach. And they’re always trying to come up with like, okay, well, what’s the best idea, what’s the ideal idea, right? Now, obviously, we have the idealist. And they do it from more of a feeling point of view of the idea. But that’s not to say intellectuals are looking for like the ideal system, or the ideal idea, or the best possible idea that we come up with, or the best way to fix the problem, or the ideal solution to a problem, right? That still is abstraction. Even though we use terms, like, we utilize terminology, you know, for what is ideal in terms of the idealist temperament. Yes, we’re aware of that, okay? So, that’s just kind of where it is. You know, the what if, the great what if, the possibilities, what’s possible, what’s going to happen? You know, what’s going to happen before it does. Now, the concrete, which is more attached to sensors, so this is SPs and SJs, it’s very different. It’s all about what is tangible, right? What is in front of you? What is the tangible, what can I grasp now? Like, I’m gonna grab some water. And I’m gonna drink some water. Here’s a good way to distinct the two between each other. This is a cup, right? A concrete person notices that this is a cup. And it’s made of plastic, and it has water in it. It has X-amount of ounces or milliliters of water in it. And this cup can hold a certain volume to it, has a certain weight to it. It has all of these tangible attributes to this cup. An abstract person does it completely different? They’re like, well, what if the cup changes inside? What if the cup, you know, the sun hits it, is it going to melt? What happens when the cup gets too hot, when it gets too cold? You know, the what if behind this cup, right? What if this happens, what if that happens? What if this doesn’t happen? That’s the abstract way of looking at the cup? What if it spills, what if it doesn’t spill? I should hold it in a certain way because of this, that, blah, blah, blah. Now, remember, every human being has the ability to perceive in terms of abstraction and concrete, everyone does, right? This is what makes it difficult for people to differentiate, okay, well, who’s concrete, who’s abstract. Which category can I put them into? The answer to that is basically what do they do primarily, right? What do these people do primarily? 


Are they primarily concrete or are they primarily abstract? What did they do more often than the other? You have to ask yourself that question. In fact, you have to do that with any of this. So, direct versus informative, is this person primarily director or primarily informative. Are they primarily movement, or are they primarily control, right? You know, are they primarily abstract? Are they primarily concrete? It’s all about primary and secondary. It’s all about yin and yang equilibrium, right? Because when it comes to psychology every aspect, every component of psychology is literally a yin and yang equilibrium. And this yin and yang equilibrium allows us to see what’s pliable. It also allows us to see what’s firm, you know, versus yin versus yang, of course. So, what is primary and secondary? Because even yang has secondary yin attributes. Even yin has secondary yang attributes. That’s why we have the little dots inside of each of the different yin and yangs, right? That’s how that works. So again, when you’re trying to classify people in this way from a psychological standpoint, you want to make sure that you’re paying attention to what’s primary and what’s secondary, right? You really only have to pay attention to that. Because logically speaking, you could figure out all the tertiary functions and everything else after the fact, after you’ve at least identified what their ego is by knowing their interaction styles versus the temperaments, right, it’s very simple. But anyway, back to concrete, how do we define concrete? It’s all about tangibility. It’s all about what is actually real? What has actually happened? What is provable in terms of what has happened? What is happening right now? It’s all about the what is, what is tangible, what is happening? You know, what is happening right now? It’s all about what is in front of you. Another way of looking at it is about what a person is able to observe, right? It’s all about observation. Concrete is all about what a person observes. And it could be they’re observing from a distance and seeing what someone else is doing. Or they’re observing in terms of what they are experiencing. Oh, I just had this experience, right? So, I’m an SI user. And my secondary concrete trait is introverted sensing because it’s an inferior function. If it was a parent function or a hero function I would be primarily concrete. And in that case I would be an SJ, right, for introverted sensing. And because it’s in the child’s or in the inferior slot of my ego, that means I’m actually abstract because extrovert intuition, for example, if introverted sensing is in the inferior slot, that means expert intuition has to be in the hero slot. Then, ergo, as a result of that I’m an abstract because I have my intuitive function in the top two slots of my ego, right? By default, I’m abstract, and thus I communicate abstractly primarily using abstract language, right, versus concrete language. It’s the language with which someone communicates with, but they’re doing it from a perception standpoint. How are they perceiving things? 


And how are they communicating about things they are perceiving? So, you have abstract language versus concrete language. And remember, concrete is about observation. It’s about what is real. It is about, you know, what’s useful, tangible. It’s all about tangibility. Whereas, abstract is about the intangible. It’s about the what if, it’s about the possibilities. It’s very yin focused, whereas concrete is more yang focused, right? Again, another yin and yang equilibrium. And all of these components you gotta kind of keep track of. But again, primary versus secondary, right? As long as you got primary and secondary handled you should be good to go. Now, it’s kind of interesting. Because abstract people see reality as kind of arbitrary. But you see, concrete people, they see possibilities, what if, intangible things as completely arbitrary. And this sucks too, because there’s more people who are concrete on this planet. In fact, 70% of the population of this planet right now, they’re concrete. They use concrete language, they’re concrete thinkers. They perceive in concrete terms, right? So it’s very easy for them to have this bias against abstract people. And saying, oh, those people, and the way that they think, and feel, and go about life, those people are arbitrary. Like, this is very arbitrary. Why am I gonna bother wasting my time listening to these people, or doing what they say, or bother hiring this person for this particular job? Because this guy is talking all the time in arbitrary terms. How is that useful to me, right? That’s why concrete people tend to shy away from abstract people, and abstract people tend to shy away from concrete people. This is also a huge source of conflict in our race. You get conflict in the family level. What if the majority of the family is concrete and you have one abstract person, right? What if 50% of the family’s abstract versus concrete? You know, if there’s a majority, it could be an issue. You have to be aware of the potential issue, the potential problem there. And with tangibility, you know, it’s all about memories, right? It’s more about memories, instead of the abstract way, which is implication, or the what if, or the meanings, or the symbols about it. Whereas, it’s about like the actual with the concrete, it’s the what is, the great what is, is the concrete. 


The abstract is the great what if, right? So, hopefully you guys could see the difference between tangibility versus intangibility, right, and how that really drives people with how they communicate with others and how that brings people about to just a better point of view, a better way of doing things. I mean, another example here, like, for example, I’m a very abstract person. I lack concrete skills, I have to be trained specifically, which means growing up, I didn’t really like the idea of working on a car in the shop with my dad. You know, he’s an ENFJ trying to live vicariously through his son. So, he has an ISTP subconscious. It would make his son super happy if his son was similar to an ISTP or similar to him in that way with liking cars, or tools, et cetera. And honestly, I just didn’t really care that much for it. And that’s because I’m more about the abstraction. Whereas, he’s focused on the concrete of being that ISTP in that moment because he’s aspiring with his ISTP subconscious and trying to encourage me to look at the concrete things of the world. When as a child I was more caring about abstract. And that’s the thing about intuitives. Intuitives care very much about the abstract in their youth. But as intuitives get older they actually start caring more about the concrete. Whereas, it’s the other way around for the S types, the concrete types. They care so much more about sensing and what’s concrete in their early age. And then they care way more about intuitive concepts at their later age. And this is why when you get to like your 40s and 50s, and people are getting divorced, and they’re starting new relationships with people, they’re in relationships with people who they find that they’re more compatible with those other types. So, when I talk about social compatibility, right, there’s a reason why social compatibility is set up the way it is. Because people as they age, they are more open to the concrete or the abstract, the opposite of what they’ve started out with basically, you know? 


If you’re an abstract ego that means you grew up caring more about the abstract. But as you get older, as you aspire and enter in your subconscious you’re more paying attention to like, if you’re abstract at first, then you’re gonna be concrete or the other way around, right? If you started out as concrete you’re going to end up more open and more willing to seek out the abstract, right? This is just how it works all over the place. This is a very normal concept. This is how life is organized these days. This is how people communicate with each other using abstract or intangible language, the great what if. And then people are communicating with concrete language, which is the what is, or the reality, or this is real to me, or this is tangible. Or there’s an actual memory here, and I’m here to make memories with you, right? Whereas, this is kind of why abstract folks don’t really care as much about photos and pictures as much as concrete people do. Because they really take memories and they value memories absolutely seriously. Whereas, abstract people it’s all about, okay, well, what are the potential memories that we’re gonna get? Because again, when we talk about intangibles it’s all about potential, right? You can look at it this way. Concrete is all about kinetic energy, whereas the abstract is all about potential energy. Just looking from a physics model you can kind of understand how our psychology works in this area in terms of comparing abstract versus concrete. Anyway, I think I beat this horse pretty well here. And okay, yeah, 20 minute lecture. A little bit shorter for these kinds of lectures right now, but that’s okay. I didn’t really need to say much because the concepts are pretty simple when it comes to the temperaments. So again, if you want to identify someone between a sensor or an intuitive. You know, if they’re an SJ or an SP they’re concrete. If they’re an NT or an NF temperament they are intuitive. So, guardians and artisans are concrete. Intellectuals and idealists are abstract. 


And just pay attention to their language, and how they perceive things, and what they talk about, are they focused on the what if or the what is? And are they doing it primarily, right? If they are, then you know, okay, this person’s abstract or concrete. And you have a better clue of, okay, this guy is either an SJ or SP, or this woman is an NT or an NF. And you’ve been able to eliminate two more of those types. Because you’ve got their interaction style. You’ve got four types. And now you’ve just figured out, okay, well he’s either a sensor or an intuitive. And I know, okay, I’ve eliminated two of the temperaments, so I’m good to go, right? So anyway, that’s this particular lecture of this episode. 


So if you found this lecture useful, helpful, educational, enlightening, and insightful, please subscribe to the channel here on YouTube and also on the podcast. Leave a like while you’re at it because likes are the dopest. If you have any questions about abstract or concrete, please leave in the comments section below. And I’ll do my best to answer your questions as usual. If you have not joined the Discord, please join the Discord for our Q and A sessions. And if you haven’t joined our meetup group in the Bay Area, and you’re in the Bay Area or will be visiting it pretty soon, go ahead and join. And I will also be putting up some additional meetups on the schedule very soon as well. So, thank you all for your patience for that. Also, pretty soon we’re going to be making an effort to get my test out. I know people have been asking about it. And we’re also gonna be releasing my book list as well, what I’m reading now, and what I have read, and what I recommend for reading, especially studying this science or anything else that I study or anything else that I present here on the channel. So, we’ll have that available to you as well. Anyway, I hope the volume’s not too bad on this lecture. So hopefully it works out just fine. Otherwise, I’ll see you guys. I gotta travel back home to California tonight. So I’ll see you guys tomorrow, have a good day.

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