Season 9, Episode 2 Transcript
– Hey. C.S. Joseph, csjoseph.life. I’m back again with another lecture. I know that we started the Social Compatibility series, but they take a lot out of me. And I have a lot of user-requested videos from our subscribers. So I am going to continue to be doing in between the compatibility lectures, I’m gonna be doing type comparison lectures, as well, because I continue to be bombarded, daily, with questions about, what’s this type compared to this type? They’re very similar, I’m trying to figure out which type I am and if you could do a video on that, it would save me a bunch of time and it would just really helped me out. Yes, I’m hearing your pleas. Yes, I’m going to do them. I’m going to do all of them. I don’t care if it takes 1,000 lectures, we’re gonna get through all of them.
This is Jungian analytical psychology 101, times 10, to the point we’re at the 1,000 level. You know what I mean? We’re gonna get there. All of them will be done. We’ll figure that out. Also, I have to mention, do not forget the email list. I know, I’m not trying to be like, ooh, get on my email list so I can send you newsletters and stuff, so I can market to you and give you annoying advertisements and take over to your email. No, I’m not going to do that. No, no, no. I’m telling you because I’m going to be filming an additional lecture series that’s only made available to those who are on the email list. So sign up, go to csjoseph.life, front page, put in your email, that’ll get you in. And then, you will receive the videos for that. The videos will be contained in a hidden playlist so that as long as you subscribe to the email list, I’ll give out the playlist link every now and then. But once you’re subscribed, that you’ll be getting the videos individually, and then you’ll be able to go from there. These will not be available on the podcast, just so you know.
They will not be available on the podcast. I may make them available as a season on the podcast in the future, I’m just not sure. And here’s what the subject matter is, in case you’re wondering, okay, well, what is it? We did the cognitive transitions video and we use the ESTP as the example. I’m gonna be doing cognitive transitions for every single one of the 16 types. And it’s gonna be the first lecture series that will be made available privately through the email list. So if you want to be able to see the cognitive transitions series, you gotta get on the email list, and that’s how you’re gonna get access to those. I’m hoping to get, hoping to get, four? Two to four of those out a month for that lecture series. Or, you just might see randomly six of them in a random weekend because I got a hair up my ass. You never know. So anyway, with that in mind, let’s dive into tonight’s material, which is, dinging sounds in the background. No, no, that’s nothing.
Anyway, ISTJs versus ESTJs, compared. Okay, yeah, they’re both STJs, fair enough. One is direct initiating control, that’s ESTJ. One is direct responding movement, that is the ISTJ. So they’re both direct, but one of them is control, one of them is movement. They’re both traditionalists, past-focused, duty-based protectors. Although what they should do, they do not know what they want to do or care what they want to do, depending on the perspective. But we’re just gonna do a deep dive right in for you. So here we go. Enter the ESTJ. So, hero rationale parent is duty, the past, a long-term memory, of a short-term memory being down here with the critic, which is a physics. A metaphysical awareness with the child, which gives you the INFP subconscious, with the Fi morals, inferior, cause they’re very philosophy, philosophy focused with the INFPs, it’s very important. And cause, it’s a little bit differently ISTJ, for their subconscious. And then obviously, the ISTP shadow with Ti Logic, Se Physics, Ni Willpower, Fe Ethics,, et cetera. The ESTJ like, does not give a about how you feel. I’m sorry, nor they’ll ever will. They’re just gonna walk by, they’re gonna take a grenade, pull the pin throw it in the room, shut the door and leave. Boom! That’s just what they do. They just walk by, throw out a zinger and just keep on walking as if nothing happened with a smile on their face, because that’s what ESTJs do. ISTJ is a little bit different. ISTJs, they actually are trying. They’re literally trying to figure out how you feel but as hard as they try, they have no fricking clue.
It’s like a black hole. So they ended up becoming even more socially awkward because they have those social full pause constantly. It’s like, I have no idea how you feel. So I’m trying to figure it out. they’re kind of like those people that will follow you into the restroom. And then while you’re taking a crap on the toilet in the restroom, they’re having a conversation with you in the men’s restroom or the women’s restroom or whatever even though you’re busy taking a crap. Well, ISTJs do that, but ESTJs no, they’re not even gonna bother doing that because they just don’t really care how you feel that much. And you know what, they’re just probably gonna wait until you’re done or not even care, they’re just gonna move on to something else that’s in their priority level, because it’s just not relevant to them at that point in time. Because again, they don’t care. So what is the main difference? ESTJs, they really value, rationale and process. It’s all about being processed. They’re very leadership oriented because they’re direct initiating control. So they’re focused on being in charge.
Whereas ISTJs, don’t actually really engage with people from being charged although their ESTP shadow, what makes them desire to at least be in charge sometimes, especially when they’re feeling like they’re in a room full of stupid people and it’s like, crap I’d probably should take charge and then they actually try to, which ends up, and ending people cause they’re trying to make everyone do more work with all these extra processes, and all these extra policies that they have to follow, it’s just really super annoying and it’s just not going to work. Whereas, the ESTJs like, yeah, process and policy is great, but if it still gets in the way of me doing my job, I’m not gonna be able to do it. Why? Well because the ESTJ likes to chart the course with their ISTP, see it through shadow because that shadow is like, yeah I need to get some work done. So let me get some work done.
Oh, you’re trying to enforce some policies on me. Yeah, no, I’m not interested in that. We’re not even going to go there and that could be a problem. Just be aware that also, it is kind of very mechanical. ESTJs really like going sky diving, or competing in Olympic sports a lot more so they can be very driven in that way and a lot of that comes from their Se Critic. However, the ISTJ, they can do that. But I mean, for some reason in our first world society, they just, they get so lazy with their Si Hero, their Fi Child, that they’re not really as able or as motivated to do those physical feats. Not to say that ISTJs can’t, some will do, but it’s just like not as high a priority, especially like going to the gym and quite not. ESTJs, super prioritize going to the gym and having a low body fat, ISTJs, not so much. Although it can be a priority for some of them, not really that much.
And because they’re both high Si users, these two types are very prevalent within military organizations, all about duty, honor, being in the military. Also firemen, police, ambulance, first responders, coast guard, et cetera, rescue operators. These two types are heavily involved in that, except the ESTJ takes a more of a leadership role. Whereas, the ISTJs more of an execution role, they walk around, keep track of all the data all the right regulations and handle it well. ISTJ is aware of the data and the regulations, it’s just not as important as actually engaging and they actually getting something done in that regard from an in-charge standpoint. Leading people, giving orders, recommending, whereas the ISTJs just going to like, do the job, et cetera.
So anyway, all about rational hero. The hero for the ISTJ is introvert sensing. They prioritize what they should do. They prioritize their own experience, how comfortable they are, more so than the ESTJ. The ESTJ is willing to put themselves into uncomfortable situations more often than the ISTJ, but the ISTJ can take a lot more hits than the ESTJ, definitely a lot more hits. They have a lot more endurance than the ESTJ and they can, even though the ISTJ could be, you could say, that they’re more sensitive than ESTJs, but that sensitivity just gives them the ability to endure more. Whereas, the ESTJ ends up having that reputation it’ll kinda little bit more sensitive at least socially speaking, but it’s mostly because the ESTJ is walking around feeling like they’re a bad person compared to the ISTJ, where they don’t have that problem because Fi Child, they just really know how to properly value themselves when compared to Fi Inferior over here on the ESTJ, because ESTJ is like, Oh I’m afraid I’m a bad person.
Whereas, ISTJs like, well, I know I’m a good person, so get over it. Like, I’m not even worried, I’m not even gonna worry about it. However, the ISTJs struggles with fear. And this, in my opinion, is why you will see ESTJs jumping out of airplanes more so than ISTJs because fear. While the ESTJ is a fear of, as a fear that they may be a bad person or they’re not good enough. The ISTJ is afraid of the, what if… What if I die? When I jumped out of the airplane, What if we all die? If we jump out of an airplane. What if this, what if that, what if this goes wrong? What if my parachute doesn’t work? And it’s this huge, what if thing? And they end up becoming more afraid. So they ended up stuck in their comfort zone, which means they’re not able to engage. They are not able to get over that fear in that regard, unless they aspire, of course and going to their subconscious, their ENFP subconscious then definitely they could aspire in that way. And then as a result, they could jump out of the airplane but the more immature or less developed an ISTJ is, they’re probably gonna be too afraid to jump out the plane and be stuck in their comfort zone because their comfort zone is technically larger because 100 frames a second versus 75 frames a second of awareness.
If you have such a high comfort zone awareness you’re going to higher prioritize comfy ness. And the ESTJ does not prioritize being comfy, more so than the or the ESTJ does not prioritize comfy ness more than the ISTJ does. So be aware of that. One that prefers comfort more than the other, one prefers processes and policy more than the other. But the other one is just kind of more of an enforcer of it where the other one’s more of like, a delegator of it because, think of it like they both get involved in project management pretty hard but this one does it like a leader of project managers. Whereas, this is just like the basic project manager that’s not necessarily a leader even though they kinda want to be but they don’t because when they do they become the ESTP shadow, they just alienate people. That’s really gonna work. Anyway, if you talk Fi Child, the child for the ESTJ is expert intuition. Expert intuition is important because to the ESTJ standpoint, they’re all about giving what other people want. They really focused on what others want.
Whereas, the ISTJs are afraid of what other people want. They are afraid about what might happen or what their intentions are. But the ESTJs like, willing to pull someone aside and be like, Hey, I see what you’re doing over there but you’re gonna want this. I had a really good experience doing this one thing, I went to this amazing spa, I had a great massage and here’s her card and you will definitely wanna have that experience cause I had a great a experience, you should go. I had an ESTJ co-worker who would do the float tank therapy all the time, he’s always trying to get me to go with him because he’s like, dude, you want to do this. It is an amazing experience. I had a great experience. So he was just tell me every facet about it and he’s Si Parent, and then he was telling me, this Ne Child, that I wanna do that. And ISTJs, never gonna do that. ISTJ is gonna be like, yeah, I had a great experience and they’re just to kind of keep it to themselves but they’re not really, they’re kinda insecure about what other people want and not necessarily there to get in the way of pushing other people’s wants as much, unless they’re aspiring with their ENFPs subconscious but they’re kinda not really going to do that. So just be aware of that. We already talked about Fi Inferior with being difficult to or being afraid, that they’re a bad person.
We talked about Ne Child, we talked about Si Parent and talked about those here. So let’s talk about the subconscious. So the INFP subconscious, the ESTJ is very philosophical. Whereas, the ENFP of the ISTJ is more focused on belief, beliefs and a brand. This is typical of ENFP but philosophy is like, it’s like a personal belief and I’m gonna put personal philosophy here. Whereas, belief, it’s like the philosophies of everyone else, so it’s like external. It belongs to other human beings, external beliefs because ENFPs are so focused on the beliefs of others. The ISTJ becomes this walking out library of Alexandria, specifically for anyone to go up to the ISTJ and ask them a query or a question or an inquiry of some kind and the ISTJ will remember and provide the sources and the reference points specifically by memory. So that person is able to change their beliefs about something that they’re thinking about, and then they can go off and do their own thing, and there’s some kind of change there. Whereas, the ESTJ does that a little bit different with an INFP side.
The INFP side, basically is focused about the personal philosophy. Their version of the library of Alexandria is not so much publicly accessible. It’s for themselves to develop their own core personal philosophy and whether or not they decide to teach it or not, that’s really up to them. They can do that, but it’s more of a one-on-one, where is a one to many relationship. The ISTJs, ENFP subconscious, this is more of a one-on-one introverted situation when the ESTJ is trying to confer their personal philosophy to other people. That’s why ESTJs are so good going with, with ESTPs in that way, because the INFJ really jives with that also with the ENFJ subconscious of the ISTP and also jives with that because that ENFJ subconscious takes on that personal philosophy and is able to execute it from an in-charge standpoint because it’s like one in-charge type going to behind the scenes, giving to, chart the course see it through type who goes with their in-charge type and they’re able to carry on that personal philosophy, and then executed out for everyone else. Whereas this one’s just trying to change the beliefs of others, so that other INFJ subconscious, for example, out there could receive that could have their beliefs changed and then they’re able to execute the new belief system et cetera.
It’s all about systems integration and how it flows. That’s how their subconscious, subconscious see, subcontri? Well, I have no clue how those two subconscious areas of the mind kinda interact and how they’re different from each other. So the shadow. The ESTJ walks around worried that they are stupid, they walk around worried that they’re not intelligent. That’s why they’re constantly going to other people asking them, Hey what do you think about this? So that they can verify what they know so that they are not worried about what they know. Whereas the ISTJ, is expert sensing. They are worried about the experience that they’re giving off to other people. They don’t want to look bad. ESTJs do not care about looking bad as much as ISTJs do because they are worried that they will give off a bad scent or a bad look or their shoes untied and let me tell you, the ESTJ takes that very seriously but the ISTJ is even more sensitive to that and if you were going to accuse a ESTJ versus an ISTJ looking ugly, the ISTJ because there’s more awareness and extroverted sensing, the physical environment the now, et cetera, physics, the present, the ISTJ would be more sensitive and they’d be more offended than the ESTJ. Whereas, the ESTJ would look and be like, okay, yeah, he’s right, I’ll fix it. Or the ESTJ would be like, no, he’s wrong and then throw them in the dumpster. Whereas, the ISTJ will be like, what is it?
I mean, he might be right, because Ne gets involved inferior and he’s like, well he might be right. And he says, he’s telling me right now he’s having a bad experience, he might be wrong. I don’t know, I don’t know, I don’t know. And these two just like start ganging up with each other, and then it just turns into like, this huge crazy spin cycle and just goes down. Whereas, something similar happens to the ESTJ with their fifth and fourth function here because it’s like, Oh crap. I might be stupid, but if I’m stupid that might mean that I’m a bad person too. And then they ended up having like this emotional breakdown secretly, he can’t really tell it’s happening but when they really just feel like and then they kinda seemed all depressed and you’re like, what the heck happened, man? It is like, well, I did this thing and I feel bad about it. I just don’t really know what to do. I tried to apologize, but they don’t want to talk to me. I mean, what do you recommend? Then they’re looking, they’re like, okay, what do you think about it? And then they’re just like, okay, what can you do for it?
And of course, the ISTP or the ESTP in that moment would give them some tips on how to handle it socially and ESTJs like, okay, fine. And then they’re really committed to trying to get that person a good experience with their Se Critic cause their Se Critic demands that the ESTJ provides the perfect experience, even though Se Child is kind of even, or Se Inferior is even more, more focused on trying to be as absolutely perfect with the experience, more so Se Inferior because it becomes an as aspirational function. But the critic is the wise old man, It is the or old woman, it is the wise Sage that knows all there is to know about its realm and it’s realm was extraverted sensing for the ESTJ and it holds such a high standard of excellence in terms of looking good and sounding good and coming off well and giving that awesome first impression wearing that tie and that suit, et cetera. That is where the ESTJ is, to the point where they will come up to you and just start picking at you with everything. But of course, ISTJs will do that to you even more. I mean, I know an ISTJ woman, I just will not allow anyone that she’s dating into her house because she’s concerned that it would upset the balance of the house. And she’s more content to going over to her, to their place and their realm instead of allowing them to come into her house because she just can’t stand the fact that she’s afraid that they might destroy. Se again, these two functions together, might destroy the balance of their home and things would be out of place and it’ll be dirty.
You have to clean it up cause she doesn’t wanna have to do that because ISTJs really take the physical environment of their homes very seriously. Everything has its place. Everything eventually has to be perfect. They’re clean freaks, everything has to be clean. Everything has to be respected. ESTJs very similar and have similar standards but they are not as sensitive to it and after a while they’ll just be not in the mood to handle it. But, even when the ISTJs not necessarily in the mood, they’ll get cranky and then they’ll just do it because it will just bump them until it’s done and then they’ll have to deal with it because they force themselves to do it. That’s introverted sensing, when you force yourself because it’s what you should do because it’s what you imagine your duty is, et cetera. That is the fifth function, the logic versus physics. The Ti Critic of ISTJs are excellent back to library of Alexandria mode. They absolutely have to verify everything they know. If they are going to feel that something is true with our Fi, Te, right here, I feels this thing is true, just because they feel it’s true, they ended up knowing that doesn’t necessarily mean it makes it true, so they have to verify it because Ti, Fe, is all about what I believe. It is not what is true, it’s what I believe.
It’s completely different. Ti, Fe or a Te, Fi is all about, what I believe. So he’s like, okay, great, I believe it. But hold on, I need to come down here and verify it’s actually true first. Then they’ll do a lot of research and get tons of reference points, a bunch of sources, et cetera, citations and read all this research until they’re like okay, yes, this is actually true. So I feel good about having this belief. This is one belief. And then you just stack up a bunch of beliefs inside of them as a result of the library of Alexandria because we have Si, Te, teaming up together to create that library of Alexandria. And then the, Fi, how they feel about those reference points and that sent down here to the critic to verify everything. And it creates this little walking library of Alexandria so they could pre-box beliefs and shoot it out with their expert intuition into their ENFP subconscious and where they are giving beliefs to other people and belief systems to other people, et cetera. And so that those people can execute new belief systems where it’s different with the ESTJ, they just do it because they’re trying to develop their core personal philosophy for themselves. They’re not trying to create a set of beliefs or set of philosophies for others. That’s what the ISTJ does. So that is what Ti Logic is, they are so critical over what’s true. If you say anything around them, if you posit anything out, they’re like, okay, well prove it to me, cite your sources, show it to me. Like, you expect me to believe this? I need to see your data. There you’d, this thing and do that.
ESTJs will do that as well but not as much as the ISTJs because ESTJs are a little bit more open-minded with their Ne Child, hey, that guy might be right, and I might be stupid and wrong, and I may, and I’m afraid I’m a bad person. So I’m gonna give this guy his day in court, and listen to them out and hear them out. Whereas, the ISTJ is more closed minded and they wanna see data up front before they make any decision. If you’re going to be selling to either one of these, be aware of that, take advantage of the fact that the ESTJ was usually they’re in middle management decision makers the ESTJ is there specifically, they have a more open mind and you can engage them in that way. If you’re gonna be trying to sell to an ISTJ, make sure you have your numbers and your data at the top before of your presentation, whatever before you even decided to engage them or even talk about the product. Because if they, if the numbers don’t match, they’ll be like, Oh, no, next and then you’re out. Or if the numbers work for them, you’re like, okay, yeah. Now I hear what you have to say. ISTJs are all about that.
So let’s talk about the tricksters. Well, we already talked about this ethics, that was the bathroom, the bathroom example. Introverted intuition, so ESTJs, they try to want things, Oh, I wanna go do that. But then they fail at wanting and they ended up almost always wanting the wrong thing which kinda makes ESTPs and ISTPs feel good around them because the they’re like, I want the right things and you don’t even want it. And then the ESTPs who’s even afraid of wanting the wrong things still appreciates that the ESTJ wants things even worse than they do. So they’re like, Oh, thank God. I thought I was bad, but that guy’s like, Whoa I’m just gonna go get him out of the dumpster because for some reason he willed his way into the dumpster right now. Oh, he’s in the ditch here, let me go get the shovel. Oh, okay, you’re back up on your feet. Okay, fantastic, yeah. ESTJs consistently get themselves in trouble with their introvert intuition trickster. Do not allow these people to buy a car alone. Okay, yes, they can use their Si, if they have experienced buying cars and they can use their Te, to figure out the proper price and whether or not they feel good about it but still they have some middle open-mindedness cause Ne Child can be taken advantage of and ESTJs, they have pretty good things that mental tools to protect themselves about it.
But ESFJs Yeah, I never let an ESFJ go to a car lot by themselves, like ever no, don’t even bother. It’s, it is a crapshoot. ISTJs not so much because they have Ni Demon, good luck selling anything to the ISTJ because they’re always trying to use that ENFP to sell beliefs to others and so the ISTJ already sees themselves as a very capable salesman. So good luck trying to sell anything to an ISTJ and if you’re in sales, you’re dealing with an ISTJ, I am so, so sorry. That’s the case, bring in an ESTP for that sales situation that ESTP we’ll get them handled. And quite frankly, an ESTP is really the only way to kind of win a sales deal to an ISTJ. Just so you’d know, they’re like the only way to do it. And if not, maybe an INFJ but yeah, seriously, ESTP, go for it. Cause Ni Demon, like, it just doesn’t wanna have anything to do with him because they’re very duty focused. They don’t wanna have anything to do with Ni. Now when they started allowing themselves to want things because of INFJ, that’s usually because they’re trying to burn their life down at that point in time, they light themselves on fire. Look, I burned so brightly care about me because I’m burning so brightly right now. I lit myself on fire just for you. And then no one answers the call and then they just burn out and everything’s gone. The typical INFJ self-destruct right?
Well, ISTJs do that too with their superego. And remember the superego exists. Yes, it could be used for great evil and can destroy people’s lives, and can get them to be super deprived or corrupt which can definitely exist because, remember virtual advice, you have corruption as the vice here, ENFP, well, you have depravity is the vice here, for example. It just a trivialness for this vice and the ENTP vice has nymphomaniac, for example. So they got a lot of interesting vices to going on in their head. They got to keep track of, primary advices. Weren’t even talking about secondaries or tertiaries or the fourth level because if you think about it, there’s four cognitive functions in the head. There’s technically a virtual advice attached to each of them. We’ll do videos on that later, if you know what I mean. It’ll be dope. Anyway, just be careful, the INFJs superego, it can light itself on fire. They, ISTJs when they hit rock bottom they are willing to reset their life. That’s what the superego is for. It will destroy all of it, will destroy their reputation. It will destroy all their relations to other people. It will burn the bridges with literally everyone and they will uproot themselves and go elsewhere completely start a new well, while having nothing to do with anything in that previous life per se because it’s like, okay, you’re dead to me. I’ve moved on and cut you off.
And that’s the INFJ door slam on life basically, and they have a new life now to the point where they’re even willing to change their name in some situations, but that’s usually are because of an ISTJ or a Si Hero. And Fe Demon, we already talked about the ESTJ, they just don’t really care about how anyone feels, so good luck trying to get them to care because they don’t. They only care about themselves with Fi Morals, that doesn’t mean that they’re not, all it means is that they lack empathy. These are trying to be empathic but they’re very sympathetic but ESTJ is so focused on getting sympathy out of Fi, they have no time or rentals the cycles to become empathic, so do not expect empathy from either of these types, especially, ESTJ. If you’re trying to get empathy out of ESTJ, they will immediately think that you’re trying to manipulate them and they will throw you into the dumpster. Be very careful when doing this. So anyway, that completes the ESTJ versus the ISTJ.
If you have any questions about this, please leave in the comments section and I will answer your questions. If you have any other video requests, lecture requests, by all means, I’ll get to those as well. Please subscribe to the channel here on YouTube and on the podcast. That would be fantastic. And leave a like to, while you’re at it, also pretty dope. I have four different lecture series or seasons, four type comparisons. There’s going to be eight lectures per, so 16 or 32 of them total that I’ll be doing. And I will be doing them intermittently with the compatibility lecture series as well. So be aware of that and don’t forget the email list so you can get access to the cognitive transitions, private lectures as well. So, awesome. I got a lot more of these to go. So I’ll see you guys tonight.