Transcript:
What is my role exactly as an Se Ni woman in a relationship with a Si Ne man when it comes to making decisions and plans in the context of a relationship, also known as woman asks what her role is in a relationship and this is for INFJ ENTP relationships. And but before I can answer please consider subscribing to the channel so that we could finally get that awesome Delta Squad cameo we all deserve and the new Star Wars series The Bad Batch. And also please click the alert Bell. So like you are informed when I go live because you’re in like our notification club and whatnot.
And because like, you never know when I’ll go live because I’ll go live randomly and stuff. So do that, please. That being said, what’s up? Miko? Hackers. This is the CS Joseph podcast and I’m your host CS Joseph, here to respond to your questions on all things union analytical psychology or the four sides of the mind.
And the source of today’s question is a member of our acolyte tier membership within the CSJ community, which I highly recommend you guys check out combining acolyte with journeymen, it’s only 100 bucks a month, and you get you get the ability to have email correspondence with me every month. And that’s exactly where this question came from. It was email correspondence with a member of our community. And I’m not going to reveal her name here.
But she’s cool. She’s an INFJ. She asked me a question, I thought it would be important to talk about this topic with the rest of the audience. So you all are getting that benefit.
So thank you to this person for being a member of our acolyte membership. And I look forward to seeing her on our next coaching session. So let’s get down to it. Here we go.
So a little context or question, she actually provided some context of the question, so I’ll read you some of it. So she says, traditional gender roles dictate that the man should primarily have the initiating a leadership role. But as I know from young in psychology, it is the role of the NI user to initiate and choose the best path forward no matter their gender question, Mark. I even remember, he said, you said that, you know, we should be careful in terms of who we consider, you know, who has the responsibility of making plans in the context of a relationship? Should we then ignore the traditional roles and focus completely on the following that dynamics of the archetypes instead, she added a little bit more.
But I don’t think that’s appropriate to be sharing here on YouTube. So I’m not going to add a little bit more than just that. But thank you for providing the context. Okay, so let’s, let’s talk about the gender dynamics of relationships within this context.
Yes, traditional gender roles has the man being the ni se user, but that’s assuming that the woman is an SI N, ie user as well. It’s because si n e user, women are typically seen as more feminine than ni se user women, especially Crusader women, Crusader women who are s who are s J’s, they’re informative. So they have that informed interaction style. So because they’re informative, which is more indirect, instead of the, you know, more masculine approaches direct, they’re seen as more feminine that way, which by and large, because they’re more feminine, they’re technically more attractive to masculine men, if not the most masculine masculine men in general.
To that end, right. That’s typically how it goes. But in today’s day and age, traditional gender roles, which obviously showed favoritism towards SFJ, women over all the other women out there is not entirely accurate. And in fact, even traditional gender roles as displayed like in movies, you know, It’s a Wonderful Life with George Bailey, and his wife, etc.
I mean, she’s like an SFJ or behaves like an SFJ. I mean, she’s, like, considered to be like the ideal woman by societal standards, but even you know, that movie was made in the 1930s. And it’s about life in the 1920s. And and, to be honest, I don’t even think it was really that accurate for those days, then, because people were very ignorant of union psychology, and they don’t understand that, you know, quite frankly, traditional gender roles are psychologically prejudiced, they’re psychologically racist.
And that’s a problem. Like, it’s funny because like, my INFJ mentor would often call it you know, well, that person’s a typist. And I’m like, Are you saying a typist from like, a racism standpoint? Are you saying type is from the standpoint of like, you know, they’re actually typing people in good at typing people when it comes to typology is that is what you’re talking about. But obviously, in that context, he’s talking about them being psychologically right racist or prejudiced etc.
Which to be fair, all human beings are prejudiced whether or not you’re aware of it or not, you are prejudiced. Yes, you’re you’re a psychological racist. Every human being is you just need to recognize how you are and then stop that. Because like that’s important.
If you can’t accept that an eye and if you’re an STP, and you can’t accept that an intp, or an INFP, or an ISTJ behavior is normal, then you’re a racist, or, you know, a cyclist or a typist, or, let’s just say prejudice because you’re prejudging them. That’s what racism is. It’s prejudice. It’s pre judging without even actually knowing the person that’s prejudging prejudiced, prejudge, right.
So don’t do that. Okay. And you got to understand that traditional gender roles is actually a human, a form of human nurture. It is external, it’s very subjective, it’s not actually objective, we know archetypes are objective.
It when in when compared to nurture, we know human nature is objective, more objective compared to human nurture, which is subjective is the point I’m trying to make. So because of that, you know, subjectivity within traditional gender roles, you know, dictating this, it’s not entirely like, you know, accurate, it’s, it’s subject to change, especially by culture by person, or whoever you ask, because you could ask a very masculine woman, like an STP woman, or an auntie J woman, and they’d have a completely different point of view. But the reality situation is, it’s, you have to beware of nature, you actually have to kind of more adhere to nature, primarily more so than adhering to the generals that are posited by social norms or rules, or, you know, human nurture as we know it, it’s too subjective. So, but But let’s actually discuss, you know, in specific here INFJ versus en TP within the context of this relationship as it stands.
Because INFJs, they’re all about their plants, they love plants, although they’re dogshit at making plans, and even adhering to their own plans. So and that’s why that’s why they are actually typically supposed to be in relationships with philosopher types, which are really, really great at making plans and even in some cases, keeping plans. But then you get into like the NFP is where they really struggle keeping their own plans, but they’re really great at making plans for other people. And then the INFJ should just run off with that plan, and then execute it.
And then everything’s good. an INFJ, especially an INFJ woman needs to have a plan, because the plan tells the woman what her boundaries are, the plan itself actually helps define the boundaries of where she can and cannot go within the relationship because she herself is affiliative. She’s always trying to do the right thing within the context of the relationship. And so she needs to have set boundaries, clear boundaries.
Because if she doesn’t have those boundaries, she’s always afraid that she’s going to fail. She has this constant fear of failure, it’s as a result of having extroverted sensing inferior, she has a fear of failure in the relationship, which ends up creating a self fulfilling prophecy that ends up leading to her failure in the relationship because she doesn’t have the proper plans. The thing is, though, she’s in a relationship with an intp, it’s the pedagogue type. And let me tell you something NTPs are terrible at making plans.
I don’t know, whoever said the intp is good at making plans. They’re not a J type, they’re a p type and P types, last I checked are terrible making plans. Unless, of course, you know, you’re a philosopher, p type, like NFPs they’re great at making plans. Why? Because they’ve extroverted thinking, you know, ENFPs are amazing.
And making plans for others, they won’t keep their own plans will change constantly, because they’re triple movement. And then I ENFPs, they’re really, really good at making plans as well, because they’re extroverted, thinking aspirational. They’re great at planning. But those plans usually adhere to others and not necessarily themselves.
Whereas the INFJ can’t make plans to save their life. But they like receiving other people’s plans, because plans actually represent boundaries for them to live by rules to live by etc. So is there a guarantee there and I their Introverted Intuition hero is guaranteed success within the context of their relationship, because they just been given a plan that they can execute. Well, that’s literally how it works.
That’s how they do it. Right. So because of that, you know, there there could be there could be some concerns there. There could be.
There could be some issues. I hope the sound is coming through, please leave a comment below and talk about the sound if the sound is good, so we made some adjustments recently. So yeah. So you know, it’s really hard for an ESTP man to make plans and oftentimes NTP men are judged by women in society that their inability to make plans and adhere to plans makes them less of a man for some reason, because for some reason, y’all women out there like biased AF towards en TPS in that regard.
And the bias is gets even worse because en TPS within life start out really, really feminine. and actually answer you and start out pretty feminine and they become way more masculine as life goes on. They end up being more masculine than the STP men that they that they do. You know, retirements, funny STP men get way more feminine and feminized as they get older, whereas ESTP men shed that femininity and become far more masculine as they get older.
It’s kinda interesting. I was just going in opposite direction. Well, the thing is, though, is that y’all need to stop judging, stop judging me and TPS that way, but you also need to stop judging INFJs that way just because INFJs can’t make plans for themselves doesn’t make them stupid, you see, and then everyone’s like accusing INFJs being stupid ditzes Because they’re not good at planning. Well, guess what? They have actually thinking trickster stop judging them for having extroverted thinking tricksters and like actually help anybody, like seriously stop doing it.
Like what value is there for it? There is no value there. So stop. Y’all judgmental, y’all prejudice, tired of how prejudiced you are. Like seriously, everyone’s prejudiced.
I don’t care what color skin you are, you’re you’re prejudiced, you are prejudiced. You see, learn how you’re prejudiced, and then start and then once you know, once you have the self awareness of how prejudiced you are and where you’re being prejudiced. Then, you know, like my parents, they’re prejudiced, they’re prejudiced, because they’re all affiliated, my sister is prejudiced, they’re affiliative. And because I’m not affiliative, lightning, because I’m pragmatic, I’m the only pragmatic person in my family, they’re automatically prejudiced against me, because I’m very independent.
And they’re interdependent. And they judge me for not being as interdependent as they are. So I’m not in the in crowd, right. Because I’m not in the in crowd, you know, there’d be no prejudice on me.
But they don’t care about the color of a skin as they have skin color skin that I have. So color skin doesn’t actually matter, folks, culture, the data is in LA actually matter. It’s really, it’s really nature. So as much as you get, like, complain about XYZ group, you know, oh, that group has more money, or, Oh, you’re white, you had a lot better or, you know, or, or, you know, Native Americans have a lot worse or all this crap, like, it doesn’t matter.
Because at the end of the day, as much as people like to pretend that they’re not racist, or prejudiced, they are, they actually really are. So you can’t get away from that. So learn how prejudiced you are, get some self awareness, and then stop doing it. Like, please, everyone needs to do this, like seriously, forgive one another, understand one another.
So you can actually forgive one another. And this let people be who they are, you know, the philosophy of Malcolm X. So we should be doing that’s how we should be living our life. The philosophy of Malcolm X is how we get closer to utopia.
You know what I’m talking about? You should like probably study him. Oh, by the way, he was an intp. No, I’m saying so like, do that seriously. But anyway, traditional gender roles don’t really mean much anymore.
Now, granted, you know, it’s easy to define, you know, what is feminine? You know, when it comes to traditional gender roles, you know, like, it’s easy, because, you know, women who look more feminine, you know, so like, women who have a lot less body fat, technically, by and large, or who have who have good hip to waist ratio, they look more feminine to men. And don’t forget, folks, men reject women far more than women reject men. I mean, whoever said otherwise, your mind because a man can look at a woman. And then if she’s like, too ugly for him, he won’t even give her any attention.
That counts as a rejection. Okay? That’s a rejection. Okay? So, traditional gender roles, they don’t really mean so much. Now, it’s really hard to define what masculine actually is.
Okay? So men are attracted to women that are beautiful, beautiful women who look good, right? Who smell good, who feel good, who are soft, like soft skin, you know, I’m saying, nice, soft skin, right? Does anyone ever cared about skin anymore? I don’t know. Women are attracted to men who have masculine behavior. It’s not about how men look, it’s how they behave masculine behavior, right? And the thing is, is like men like me, how many TPS started off super feminine, had feminine boyish behavior, very feminine behavior, going up, and even in my 20s, and whatnot, but now I have, at least you know, a few years now I have some masculine traits and a developing mat, my masculine traits, as I get older, it’s all about having more master traits and say, learn behavior. Well, here’s reality, folks.
Learn behavior is more important, then natural behavior, then talent, you know, effort, always Trump’s talent at the end of the day. Granted, the thing that the samp has me off is that people put in a lot of effort, and they don’t really care about practicing Right? Or even developing their talent, they get entitled because they put in all this effort, even though they didn’t go anywhere. It’s been on a rocking horse, lots of movement, but going nowhere. You see what I’m saying? That’s where that comes from.
Okay. So, but yeah, don’t don’t expect any intp man to you know, always make plans. It’s just not really in his nature, and it has to become a learned behavior. And if you’re a woman in a relationship with Him, you can’t like judge him as less of a man for him not being able to make plans because he’s probably like, what in his 20s in his 30s he doesn’t really have the ability to make plans until like in his 40s, maybe even 50s because it’s just not that part of it, his iossef J site is not as developed on average, statistically, I would imagine to be able to do that, because the planning side of his mind is either as iossef J or is designed TJ right? If you wanted to make plans, well give him some caffeine or get him some alcohol, the caffeine and put them in his iossef J side of his mind, or the alcohol, put them in his will put them in his INTJ side of the mind, you know, give him Adderall, they’ll be stuck in his ISFJ modally entire time, they’ll barely talk to anything really be paying attention, everything and they’ll get super mega behind the scenes, you’ll think something’s wrong with him.
Yeah, don’t ever give anyone Adderall. By the way, that’s like a really bad idea. Like no one actually really, truly understands the consequences of that. Oh, and because, you know, society is psychologically prejudiced other people were putting everyone on Adderall, all the sudden, you folks have to get to a point like when your 10 year relationship INFJ intp or any relationship, it doesn’t matter.
But you need to get to the point where you discuss what your roles are, and leave out all societal social norms and expectations. This is especially hard for this INFJ woman to do so because she has Fe parent, she is most objective in terms of you know, how society and how people should behave? Who was she to judge other people based on how they behaved? I’m not saying she is. But who is any INFJ to do that, they can’t do that. Okay, that’s not fair.
Their Fe parent does not get to dictate social norms to other people, because social norms are subjective, you’ll have to understand how social how subjective they are. And that’s not fair. So she can’t be judging her man is less of a man for that. And as much as he cannot be judging his woman as less of a woman based on her masculine behavior.
That’s bullshit. It should be okay for masculine women to be masculine. My wife’s masculine, she’s an ESTP. I think she’s smokin hot.
She’s pretty awesome. She’s getting better and better. And she just had a frickin baby, she goes to, you know, goes to work. And people are like, did you even have a baby even look like you have a baby? She shows up, you know, she’s all pregnant, whatnot one day, and she comes back to work, you know, two months later, and then all of a sudden, she’s like, they’re like, Wow, where’d all your baby weight go? Yeah, it’s gone.
Because it’s not there. Because like, she’s even, you know, smaller, the smallest that she’s ever been in, in our entire marriage, two months after the baby, you know, because hey, you know, when you’re breastfeeding comes off a lot faster. If you know what you’re doing, you know what I’m saying? Like, come on, be healthy, you know, you see what I’m saying. But like, seriously, traditional gender roles are extremely subjective as my main point, they’re not actually going to help.
You have to really break it down into what is a feminine behavior, what is a masculine behavior, do that first identify what those things mean, specifically to both of you in your relationship, then have a conversation, and then realize, okay, here’s the behavior I’m looking for from you, here’s the behavior, I’m looking for you. And then make that like, I don’t know the deal, or the contract, or at least the agreement or the understanding that you have in terms of what you’re looking for in the context of your relationship. This is all about self defined relationships. Because as long as everyone’s taking care of themselves, as long as people are taking responsibility to meet their own needs, as long as they have their personal standards, as long as they have their personal boundaries, and they’re enforcing them, then they have their personal goals and seek out the personal goals, then what’s the problem? And then they could be working together to meet all those things.
The thing is, is that if you don’t even know what your needs are, like, how to take care of yourself, et cetera, you know, like, like, in certain cases, it’s funny because like, my wife told me recently, she’s like, I’m really happy, like, when you give me advice on how I should dress and I like how picky you are, because I am picky. Like, I’m super picky about like, how how women wear things, like like, for example, I’ll go on Instagram, and like, I follow fashion nova, I do I follow fashion nova, I watched it like a hawk, because I’m always trying to find nice new pieces of clothing that, you know, I could get from my wife or something that I actually want her to wear so that she’s nice and sexy, you know, with like, doing everything she does says that she is sexy, 100% of the time, et cetera. And I put in a lot of research for that. So like, when I find when I find a photo that I like of a woman, she’s wearing something nice, I save it, and then I forward it to her account directly.
So she has it and she’s able to track it. And then she goes on, you know, to fashion over or whatever these other fashions lives to find a specific piece of clothing, see if it’s affordable, and then she gets and she adds it to a wardrobe. It’s pretty nice. It’s an example of something that we do.
But then again, I get folks in this audience here is like, oh, you know, Mr. CS Joseph, he’s following a bunch of, uh, you know, half naked Instagram models all the time and they’re getting all pissy about it when it’s actually just some negotiated thing that I have in my marriage. That’s none of their effing business to begin with. Y’all are judgmental.
So like stop that. You see traditional generals. It doesn’t matter. You have to negotiate it out on a relationship by relationship basis.
For example, My ISTP cousin, who is married to an ISTJ, he’s the cook, he cooks dinner every night. Or I have a friend of mine who is an ISFP. He’s married to an ES TJ, and they got married. And then like, on their honeymoon, she went all traditional gender roles on him.
And she started to cook for him. And he was so unhappy with what she made for him, that he lost it. And then he’s like, you’ll never cook in this house again. And then he cooks.
And he loves cooking, because it’s an art. Because he’s an artist, and she gets to enjoy his amazing meals, he’s happy with the meals that he gets. It’s all good. It works for them.
It’s their marriage, it’s their relationship. Okay. So really, to answer your question, really focus on your gender roles that you decide within your relationship, do not let society dictate it to you, you have a right, anyone has a right to set up whatever gender roles that they want to have within the context of their relationship within the context of their home, within the context of their church, within their community, within their city, within their county, within their state, and ultimately this country, and not have anyone else in these areas, mess with them, or even judge them or be prejudiced against them. And they should be treated with mutual respect.
They respect other people’s culture that they set for their own homes. And as much as that other people respect the culture that they set for their home. This is the way of Malcolm X, who also was an NTP. You must do this, because if you don’t do this, you’re just being judgmental.
You’re just being prejudiced. So stop doing it. Okay. Granted, remember, tradition is the corpse of wisdom tradition, like traditional generals.
I mean, they’re nice, but they really only apply to SJ women, to SP men, which is only 70% of the population in terms of men to women. But even then, it’s not even 70%. It’s about 35% of the population. As shame women, SJ men, because what about the SJ men and SP women? Excuse me? I’m in SJ, women and SP men.
But what about the SJ men and SP women? doesn’t even count. So yeah, split that 70% number in half, which is 35%. Okay, so traditional gender roles, only benefits 35% of the total population. Therefore, if you are an SJ woman in relation to the SP, man, sure, you can have those traditional generals, but I just showed you how SP men are taking on the typical feminine role of cooking, but it’s not from an at all because let’s be honest, they’re better cooks than our wives.
So why, why do we have to care about this, you guys need to just abandon traditional gender roles and actually set up what the gender roles should be and negotiate them on a case by case basis. And stop being F J’s, who are enforcing this whole social norms and other people when you are not even an SF Jey you’re an NF J. Right? So don’t do that. 20 and TP Manos lawfare and TP men go out of your way to give yourself new experiences and have different, you know, disciplines in your life.
So that you can eventually give the your INFJ what she needs plans, make a plan and stick to it know that you actually can commit to a plan, stop being afraid of not committing to a plan. Because guess what, you’re stronger than the other times because you have si aspirational, which means you can D strong enough to deal with whatever consequence that would come as a result of you committing to that plan. Because the INFJ your INFJ woman here is not actually she doesn’t care about the plan. She just says she cares about the plan, like women say things but their actions don’t match their words.
That’s what women do. That’s what they do. This is why I tell men never take a woman at her word. And it’s not because she’s a liar.
I’m not saying that. It’s because she changes her mind. Women are the yen. The Yen is chaotic.
The Yen is constantly changing. So women are constantly changing their life is very cyclical. All the time. Men’s life is like going up a hill and down a hill.
But women it’s like this. It’s a frickin roller coaster with their life, constantly making decisions and change in their mind. So let them be women. Let them change their mind Don’t get mad when she changes her mind is recognize that she will Don’t take her at her word and that’s okay.
But keep your word be consistent. That’s actually what your INFJ woman is looking for in the situation is consistency because When you’re not consistent, it makes her feel insecure. And then she wants those beta traits. And who knows, I’ve known a few INFJ women cheating on their Alpha men with some betas because of those betas or at least consistent.
You don’t want that in your relationship, bro. So based on that, go out of your way to at least be consistent, commit to something. Because if you can commit to something, guess what, you’re strong enough because you have so aspirational, to actually be able to take the hits the consequences in life, to be able to handle whatever you committed to. She doesn’t necessarily care about the plan, she just claims it’s all about the plan.
It’s not about the plan. It’s about you being consistent, bro. That’s what she wants, she wants you to be consistent so that she feels secure to make decisions. And naturally, you’d want her to make decisions.
Because you’re any human, you’re all about giving her choices. So she can make choices, let her make choices. But here’s the thing, she’s not going to allow herself to make choices until you are consistent enough so that she feels safe enough to make decisions in the first place. And that, my friend, is how you’re execute this relationship properly.
So to answer the question, what is my role exactly as an SE ni, user woman in a relationship with an si ne user, man, obviously, going out of your way to make him comfortable, that’s important, make him feel wanted and desired. Don’t take him for granted. But he needs to be consistent, and be disciplined and strong enough such that he’s putting an effort so that he can actually be Wantable and desirable by you. If he’s not desirable, chances are he’s not putting in enough effort and potentially stuck in his comfort zone and being lazy.
But even then, even if he is putting in the effort ENTP men, they all have this freaking problem. They all have this problem where it’s like, oh, I put in a lot of effort. So I’m entitled to being wanted. Wrong, you’re not entitled to anything.
Because the reality situation is, is that just because you put in a lot of effort, doesn’t mean you’re going anywhere. My father, my ENFJ father told me all the time as a little kid, and it’s the number one lesson he ever taught me, quote, do it right the first time, which means you could put a lot of effort, but ENTPS we often put our effort in the wrong thing, just trial and error and all the time, effort, effort effort, when we don’t even realize that there might be some things that are better for us to put our effort into compared to other things, et cetera, right. So that’s what an si ne user man is supposed to do in the context of this INFJ intp relationship. The thing is, it has nothing to do with making plans.
And that has nothing to do with traditional gender roles. Just get rid of that crap, it doesn’t matter. Just be consistent. And then she’ll be able to make decisions.
It’s that simple. And then for her go out of your way to practice, stop trying to take shortcuts. INFJs, especially INFJ. Women, I don’t know what it is about you folks and shortcuts, but you’re constantly making shortcuts and all your decisions.
Stop making shortcuts actually take the time to practice putting in a little bit more effort. Okay, just because it’s not a shortcut, just because you’re not getting it right now because you’re impatient, okay? You’re not, you’re probably not gonna get the best outcome. That way. If you want a better outcome for your relationship, be willing to go the extra mile.
That’s all I’m saying. NTP men, be willing to put in the right kind of effort and put in that effort, etc. So that you remain desirable. And then that way she can respect you, etc.
Because you know, you’re being consistent, super mega important guys. And then negotiate your gender roles for your relationship within the context of your relationship and stop adhering to social norms. They don’t really matter that much they don’t masculine behavior, and then being feminine. That’s all you got to do.
Your relationship will be successful regardless of traditional gender roles that only benefits 35% of people like seriously so yeah, don’t want a guaranteed answer for your questions like these consult with the wizard yours truly at CS Joseph dot life forward slash wizard and post your coaching question and get my video response here on YouTube. Anyway, folks, all that being said, I’ll see you guys tonight. What’s up you go hackers. Thanks for watching this video and if you enjoyed it, please hit the like button below that would be the dopest also if you want to see similar videos to this video, just click on any of the videos that you see here so you can go check those out as well.
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